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Real Time: Bob Baer on Waterboarding

Real Time: Bob Baer on Waterboarding- It's Torture

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15 Comments

Current View: 15 / Show all Comments

Tada : LVL 43: VP 5: said:

Tada

56 votes NegativePositive

192 days 5 hours ago...

Just to like explain how the whole torture thing works. If "we" do it, it`s okay, because we`re the good guys. If "they" do it, it`s wrong, because they are the bad guys. This doesn`t just apply to torture, it applies to almost everything.

For example when the Soviet union invaded Afghanistan, that was wrong because the Soviets were evil. However when we invade Afghanistan, Iraq and Vietnam, it`s okay because we do it in the name of good.

When membership states in the Soviet union wanted to leave the union, it was a good thing because the Soviets were evil. However when Texas wants to leave the union, it`s treason according to some.

When we want to get nukes, it`s fine because we won`t actually use them and it`s really just deterrent. However when someone else which we don`t like wants to get nukes, they are evil, warmongering and are planning to destroy the planet even though using them would basically mean the total destruction of their country.

There are countless other examples of the we/them-hypocrisy which exists in all societies.

Just ask yourself, if China started kidnapping US citizens and started waterboarding them, not allowing them to sleep for several days and blasting them with insanely loud music while being blindfolded for days on end (all methods used on Guantanamo), how would you feel about it? Better yet, how would Fox News feel about it?

nerdicus : LVL 34: VP 4.2: said:

nerdicus

18 votes NegativePositive

192 days 2 hours ago...

^That`s because the US foreign policy is written in such a way that assumes that the world belongs to the US. When the US is invading a country, let`s say Iraq, as long as they have troops deployed there, it is US soil. If some our nation is caught with troops there, they are deemed invaders on US soil and can be dealt with accordingly.

Noam Chompsky wrote a paper on this very subject called, We Own The World. I think...something like that. It`s good.

anemis : LVL 39: VP 4.7: said:

anemis

0 votes NegativePositive

191 days 11 hours ago...

this all bush,s fault.... let,s teke him and waterboard the hell out of him....

~TechHead~ : LVL 34: VP 4.2: said:

~TechHead~

Hidden (Show Comment) -46 votes

191 days 11 hours ago...

OK LIBERALS, tell me this.

A nuke has been placed in a US city, and we have caught the individuals responsible. Now we need to find the bomb before it goes off. DO you do the following:

A) Ask them politely as to the wehereabouts of the bomb.
B) Threaten them with jail time and a life of solitude.
C) Torture them to retreive the information

Think about it. There are jut some things that require harsh methods of prying information from people. And most of the time, these captives that are being tortured are not everyday, loving citizens. They are individuals who don`t have any repsect for the rest of humanity, and seek to do harm to otherws whether you like it or not.

BTW. If you seriously think that the govt. is really going to stop torturing people to retrieve information, you really do live in a small world. Just cause Obama says torturing will be stopped, chances are that it will continue as normal. FFS, he`s lied about literally everything else he promised.

riotking : LVL 31: VP 4: said:

riotking

29 votes NegativePositive

191 days 10 hours ago...

^ okay, when has that scenario actually ever happened?

samhalverson : LVL 26: VP 3.5: said:

samhalverson

-2 votes NegativePositive

191 days 10 hours ago...

^Yes. However, this is not the issue arisen. The current use of torture is useless, and any information given is useless. What`s the info going to do, what are we trying to achieve from it? Okay, so Mr Extremist tells us that there is a camp he trained in to be a "terrorist" in Pakistan, big fucking deal, we know there are camps like this everywhere. Anything these torture victims will tell us will be useless evidence, with no motives used along with the evidence. I agree with your nuke situation though.

funberg : LVL 47: VP 5: said:

funberg

23 votes NegativePositive

191 days 10 hours ago...

@TechHead How many time do you have to be told that torture DOESN`T work.

The Japanese field manual in WWII said that torture is the clumsiest possible method of gathering intelligence, and was used mainly for intimidation, not information.

The French kept records of trying to torture confessions out of almost 800 people between 1500 and 1750(when torture was legal). They only got statements out of from 3 percent in Paris to 14 percent in Toulouse (an exceptional high percentage), and out of the few that talked at all, there is no reason to think they said anything besides what the torturers wanted them to say.

Every government knows that torture will not gather useful information, it is used only to TORTURE, to satisfy the need for vengeance and cruelty from uncivilized people.

darkjasper : LVL 40: VP 4.8: said:

darkjasper

2 votes NegativePositive

191 days 10 hours ago...

For those who don`t know what water boarding is, its basically covering ones face and pouring water over their mouth to simulate drowning.

Torture is lame and we shouldn`t allow that shit.

funberg : LVL 47: VP 5: said:

funberg

8 votes NegativePositive

191 days 10 hours ago...

And assuming your nuke situation were to take place, good luck taking one of them alive to get information from, or getting them to stand down, if they think they are going to be tortured for the rest of their lives.

FYAD : LVL 34: VP 4.2: said:

FYAD

25 votes NegativePositive

191 days 8 hours ago...

Here`s what happens in your nuke situation.

You start pulling fingernails, cutting hands off, salting the wounds, waterboarding, whatever you want to do, and your captive says "OH GOD ITS IN NEW YORK, NEW YORK GOD PLEASE STOP" and you stop, go to New York to try to stop the bomb, and then get the phone call that Las Vegas just blew up.

Good job torturing the information out of that subject! That really showed him a thing or two.

So now, the bomb`s blown up and you at least want to bring someone to `justice` for it (not that it could ever be made up for but the mob needs blood, after all...)

So lets torture the guy again and find out who set us up the bomb (couldn`t resist).

You start in again with the fingernails and waterboarding and electricution on various body parts not normally designed for amperage, and you get this loooong list of people from him. Say fifty names, maybe sixty, hell, maybe five hundred. The number is irrelevant honestly. People scattered all over the world, but `lo and behold he`s got a group of ten, twenty, thirty that live right there in your city. "LETS GO ARREST THOSE FUCKERS FIRST", comes the cry, "BEFORE THEY CAN DO ANYTHING ELSE!"

So you posse up, and sweep through the city and arrest and detain the people, and maybe, you know, apply some `advanced interrogation techniques` on them, because hey, all terrorists right?

Except your first victim (YES, victim) just memorized a bunch of ethnically appropriate names in the phone book, and now you`ve just arrested, detained and perhaps started working over *innocent civilians of your own country*.

Look how easy it is for terrorists to manipulate us EVEN AS WE FLAY THEIR SKIN OFF THEIR BODIES. I mean really, we could be cutting their dick off with an ultra thin deli slicer and still we could not depend on (or even consider truthful) anything they tell us - not just because they`re probably liars as well as murderers, but *BECAUSE* you`re cutting their dick off with an ultra thin deli slicer.

Wouldn`t you say anything to have that stop?
That`s not helpful, and if you don`t see that, you`re probably one of the people who perpetuate the stereotypes that get us white folk hated so intensely.

Keep up the good work, skippy.

hzafary : LVL 13: VP 2.2: said:

hzafary

Hidden (Show Comment) -16 votes

191 days 8 hours ago...

screw bill maher, how can he even try to justify torture? His hatred of Muslims is really turning him into a neo-con. He needs to get his head out of Israel`s ass. I`m starting to hate him more than BIll O Reilly.....and I HATE Bill o the clown

storylady : LVL 33: VP 4.2: said:

storylady

-1 votes NegativePositive

191 days 7 hours ago...

Torture is not needed. Truth drugs would give as good a result, with more certainty of a positive result.

f4Ze : LVL 23: VP 3.2: said:

f4Ze

8 votes NegativePositive

191 days 7 hours ago...

I believe that torture is counter productive.

#1. It will be used as even more justification for your enemies that see you as a scourge upon the earth.
#2. It is contradictory to your own message that America is a force of good and justice. If you want to appear just and "good" treat your enemies fairly and with respect rather than hatred and vengeance as hard as it might be. If you don`t give them any reason to hate you, then they won`t.
#3. It pushes your allies farther away from you when they see how blind and paranoid you have become.

skyhighdrolix : LVL 35: VP 4.3: said:

skyhighdrolix

7 votes NegativePositive

191 days 5 hours ago...

^^buddy buddy buddy...go to urban dictionary or something and look up "devil`s advocate." Do you REALLY think Bill Maher defends torture? Have you EVER seen his show before? And even if he did, wouldn`t you think that he would have a legitimate point to make defending the use of torture instead of sitting there? He`s playing the role of impartial journalist...the day you hate somebody more than Bill O that`s in the media is a bad day for all of us, but let me tell you Bill Maher will NOT be that person.

BrightRO : LVL 31: VP 4: said:

BrightRO

0 votes NegativePositive

191 days 5 hours ago...

Kinda offtopic here..
My biggest problem with Bill Maher is he so fucking Pro-Israel that it bleeds my fucking ears...

Even in this Israel tortures and he knocks it down to it being nothing..
Where that obviously isn`t the case.

Sorry just been annoying the fuck out of me how badly he tries to put GO ISRAEL in our minds..

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